Some tips for choosing additional equipment

All CUPRA Born related discussions
Savage
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2022 3:46 pm

Post by Savage »

I don't think the stock suspension on the born is overly harsh either, like monkeyhanger I do come from several more firmly sprung models.
Last being a Cupra Ateca that did have DCC and even on the comfort setting was a bit too firm for the rough roads I travel often.
As it happens, that car came with Bridgestones, bloody awful tyres, I swapped them out after 300 miles.
I test drove both a V2 and a V3 Born (So 20" and 19" wheels) and didn't think the 20" felt that much worse, and I did deliberately take roads with poor surfaces.
That said, part of the reason I chose a V2 was due to the 19" over the 20's but that was only a small part.

Lets not forget, although it has 19's its still a 50 profile tyre, so noticably more forgiving than 45 and 40's

Dcc I have had before on 3 cars (part of the spec I had not an option added), TBH I always set it on comfort and forget about it. I wouldn't pay for it specifically unless the cars stock suspension was really poor.
Cupra Born V2 58KWh AFV 230 Auto E-Boost with Tech Pack L in Geyser Silver.

projix
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:51 pm

Post by projix »

monkeyhanger wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:01 pm Ride comfort is personal preference - being used to driving hot hatches, I prefer firm ride and direct steering to squidgy ride and vague steering - on that basis, DCC isn't essential or a no brainer. If you have a chronic back problem or drive granny to church every Sunday then maybe the DCC makes more sense.
You probably live in a place with decent road quality. Bouncing around all over the place is not cool.
The problem are the large wheels and the very heavy weight. Hot hatches weigh much less, so it's not nearly as jarring and they don't bottom out the suspension.
A DCC on something like Golf is nowhere near as a dramatic effect as here.

You wouldn't know as you never drove them back to back. If ride quality is important at all, then the DCC is a complete no-brainer on a Cupra Born.
Also, the DCC is 700 EUR here. I would go as far as to say, if you do not take any other option, take the DCC.

I have edited the first post regarding the tyres though, this is valuable info.

As for the vague steering - the Born has quite vague steering. I think if you want a steering where you can feel something, you need a hydraulic rack, which is a bit of a rarity these days and not found on any EV's. But the Taycan's steering feel certainly comes very close to them.
Savage wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 7:40 am Dcc I have had before on 3 cars (part of the spec I had not an option added), TBH I always set it on comfort and forget about it.
You are assuming it does not do anything in that case. It does. It allows you to have a better ride at the same time as having better handling, as it's still continuously adjustable dampers.
The comfort/sport setting is just what you want the average to be. The system is much more intricate than simply changing all the dampers at the same time to one or other setting. It is adjusting every corner every 10ms.

Take the Ioniq 5 (I owned one) and EV6 (test drove one). Both ride much better than the Born. But they have clever mechanically self-adjusting dampers from ZF where the oil chamber size gets adjusted based on movement of the suspension.
No such thing on the Born and you can really feel it.

I think all EV's need some kind of clever damping system just to provide a ride similar to a standard suspension on a normal car. This is due to the increased weight.
The Model 3's and Model Y's ride is also quite bad for all the same reasons. A Taycan's ride is sublime, because on top of the DCC (or CDC) it also has the air struts. Which is what the air suspension is for VAG. DCC is just the damper part, the air suspension combines the damper with a self-leveling air suspension. The benefit on the taycan is getting the handling of a sportscar with the comfort of a luxury limo. Yes, you can do both.
Elea4
Posts: 200
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2022 5:19 pm

Post by Elea4 »

Heat pump
This is a real can of worms. The latest data shows that savings from the heat pump can only surpass the initial cost under very limited use-cases over a longer period:

"The HP [heatpump] takes over most of the heat generation for the interior when the outside temperature is above 5°C.

Between 5° and 0°C about the same amount of electrical energy is used for the heater and the HP, but below 0°C the HP runs at a very low level and the heat is mainly generated by the high voltage [resistive] heater."

- References in German:
https://www.born-forum.de/forum/thread/ ... #post36502
https://www.meinid.com/thread/4670-ante ... post166061

fwiw I didn't order it in January 2022 but by the time I received it 10 months later it had become standard equipment in Germany. Now it's the opposite: there's an MEB-wide heat pump shortage due to a lack of relevant semiconductors and some customers in many countries won't receive them and be reimbursed accordingly.


Wheels
The benefit of 18"s is having reduced road noise and less inertial mass - therefore better range. Cupra's config tool for the base model with 58kWh shows an extra 20km WLTP range vs the 19"s. As already discussed, tyre choice obviously plays a large role with noise and handling.


HUD
I thought I would love the HUD but during my test drives I found it really distracting and was having micro-focus issues while looking back and forth between the projected display and the road. Couldn't care less about the HUD identifying vehicles I can already see but the extra navigation cues would have been helpful as the navigation in the dash display isn't as readable/obvious as I'd hoped.


Beats
For my taste as a touring artist it sounds acceptable despite the minuscule sub. The value-proposition is particularly decent if you consider how much it would otherwise cost to get aftermarket rear speakers, harnesses, DSP controller/amp & sub. All the aftermarket builds I've seen people do on the Born/ID.3 have been quite a bit more expensive.


DCC
Very nice to have on crappy cobblestone streets such as here in Berlin. Must-have for me. That said some people complain that the DCC causes a lot of side-to-side rocking compared to stock suspension - yrmv.


Protect Pack (interior monitoring alarm system + pre-crash assist)
It irks me that unlike the ID-series, pre-crash assist was torn away from the Pilot/Assistant packs and lumped in with the security system. Lame. And despite Cupra Connect Gen3 being able to send a remote alarm via mobile if your car is being broken into, Connect Gen4 on the Born offers no such feature. I almost regret paying 400 euro for this package.


Panoroma roof
Don't have one but I've read ongoing reports of creaking noises from ID.3/Born owners as well as a handful of hairline cracks in the corner. Caveat emptor?
monkeyhanger
Posts: 565
Joined: Tue May 31, 2022 8:12 pm

Post by monkeyhanger »

I know what I'm used to, and my Born on 19" wheels and decent tyres is every bit as comfortable yo drive as any previous VAG warm or hot hatch I've owned. I've also had DCC before and happy to live without

Cobbled streets are a relative rarity in the UK, but still plenty of poorly maintained tarmac roads. The Born's (and EVs in general) significantly greater sidewall profile than equivalent "warm hatches" like the Golf GTD does a lot of damping in itself.

The OP mentions increased weight of EVs multiple times, but the manufacturer gets around this by using springs and shocks with greater resistance - they don't just fit the shocks and springs from a £1350kg Golf to an 1800kg Born/ID3 and alliw them to bottom out and hit the bump stops at tge end of the shock travel.

As such, the DCC is not a universal no brainer, and if driving a lot of cars (seemingly by trawling all dealerships for test drives) makes the OP a "professional" with greater insight into the driving dynamics of a Born than owners here who've been driving them 7 months already (and maybe a year in an almost identical ID3 prior), I'll defer to the valet of the local posh hotel for future car advice. :lol:
2022 V2 E-Boost L-Tech Pack - Aurora Blue
2023 Audi S3 - to avoid rapid charging on long journeys.

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projix
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:51 pm

Post by projix »

monkeyhanger wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 11:38 am The OP mentions increased weight of EVs multiple times, but the manufacturer gets around this by using springs and shocks with greater resistance - they don't just fit the shocks and springs from a £1350kg Golf to an 1800kg Born/ID3 and alliw them to bottom out and hit the bump stops at tge end of the shock travel.
Obviously. The Born is very prone to bottoming out though, much more than even a Type R. Weight always makes a difference to the compromise between performance and ride quality though. Discounting it shows lack of understanding of suspension engineering. The main cause is that the force applied to the suspension during cornering does not increase in a 1:1 linear fashion with the weight of the car.
monkeyhanger wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 11:38 am As such, the DCC is not a universal no brainer, and if driving a lot of cars (seemingly by trawling all dealerships for test drives) makes the OP a "professional" with greater insight into the driving dynamics of a Born than owners here who've been driving them 7 months already (and maybe a year in an almost identical ID3 prior), I'll defer to the valet of the local posh hotel for future car advice. :lol:
Actually I have been involved in performance engineering in the car industry professionally for over ten years. It is what I do for a living.
I probably drive more different cars in a couple months than you will do in your lifetime.
That's fine though, people can choose who they want to trust, however your argument falls flat on it's face for the same reason as you should trust what a doctor tells you, compared to someone who is "also a mom" ;)

I think I'm done here though.
monkeyhanger
Posts: 565
Joined: Tue May 31, 2022 8:12 pm

Post by monkeyhanger »

projix wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 12:31 pm
monkeyhanger wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 11:38 am The OP mentions increased weight of EVs multiple times, but the manufacturer gets around this by using springs and shocks with greater resistance - they don't just fit the shocks and springs from a £1350kg Golf to an 1800kg Born/ID3 and alliw them to bottom out and hit the bump stops at tge end of the shock travel.
Obviously. The Born is very prone to bottoming out though, much more than even a Type R. Weight always makes a difference to the compromise between performance and ride quality though. Discounting it shows lack of understanding of suspension engineering. The main cause is that the force applied to the suspension during cornering does not increase in a 1:1 linear fashion with the weight of the car.
monkeyhanger wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 11:38 am As such, the DCC is not a universal no brainer, and if driving a lot of cars (seemingly by trawling all dealerships for test drives) makes the OP a "professional" with greater insight into the driving dynamics of a Born than owners here who've been driving them 7 months already (and maybe a year in an almost identical ID3 prior), I'll defer to the valet of the local posh hotel for future car advice. :lol:
Actually I have been involved in performance engineering in the car industry professionally for over ten years. It is what I do for a living.
I probably drive more different cars in a couple months than you will do in your lifetime.
That's fine though, people can choose who they want to trust, however your argument falls flat on it's face for the same reason as you should trust what a doctor tells you, compared to someone who is "also a mom" ;)

I think I'm done here though.
Very prone to bottoming out? How do you come to that conclusion, surmising based on kerb weight only, or known cases of shock absorber (bump stop deformation/splitting, shock leakage) or top mount bearing impact damage because you think that maybe the suspension components aren't up to the task of working with that extra 450kg? Never seen a single reported incident of that for Born or ID3 on any of the big EV forums. A Civic type R is going to be flung around more than a Born by the average target audience and I don't think anyone here is making any claims that an 1800kg Born is more nimble than a 1350kg Golf GTI.

VAG don't have a "one size fits all" suspension set for all its cars that share a size segment - the ones used for their EVs are tailored to the expected demands of the ID3/Born.

Even among the performance Golfs there are very noticeable differences between the GTD, GTI and R suspension set-ups and component variants (the R being about 80kg heavier than the GTI, due to Haldex system, bigger turbo, larger discs and pads etc).

The willy waving about how many cars you drive is not in the least bit impressive, half the people on the car forums are "the Stig", didn't you know? :lol:

Either way, giving opinions about which equipment options are no brainers requires nothing of the technical knowledge you claim to have.
2022 V2 E-Boost L-Tech Pack - Aurora Blue
2023 Audi S3 - to avoid rapid charging on long journeys.

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